What you'll learn in this podcast episode

Most of us have heard the phrase, “If you see something, say something.” But what does that look like when someone witnesses bad behavior in the workplace? How can companies help their employees be active bystanders in the face of misconduct? In this episode, LRN colleagues Felicity Duncan, senior instructional designer, and Kristen Motzer, learning director, share their expertise on bystander intervention training and how organizations can effectively give employees the knowledge and skills they need to step in and help their coworkers. Listen in as the two share insights from their latest course development for the training library at LRN.

 

Principled Podcast Show Notes

[1:22 ] - What does it mean to be a bystander, and why do organizations have bystander training?

[3:05 ] - Unpacking the idea of a “Speak up culture”.

[3:40 ] - Why don’t people get involved when they see problems?

[6:08 ] - How to train people to be active bystanders?

[9:36 ] - Why are scenarios so important?

[12:14 ] - How DEI relates to bystander intervention.

[15:26 ] - How having a robust bystanding and speak up culture will benefit partners.

 

Featured guest: Kristen Motzer

Kristen Motzer is an experienced leader in values-driven, empathetic behavior change. As Learning Director for the LRN Library she oversees course content development and online, blended, and facilitated learning experiences. She has expertise in human-centered learning design and has developed and managed education and learning programs at institutions such as NYU Langone Health, NeuroLeadership Insitute, Stanford University, Xavier University, and the Cleveland Clinic. Kristen holds a BA from Wright State University and an MA from Carnegie Mellon University and resides in Chicago.

 

Featured Host: Felicity Duncan

Dr. Felicity Duncan believes that training and communication interventions have the power to transform behavior, including driving people toward more ethical treatment of those around them.

Felicity graduated with a Ph.D. in Communication from the University of Pennsylvania. After teaching at the college level for several years, she transitioned to workplace education to have a bigger impact on working adults by providing them with the training they need to truly thrive in their roles. At LRN, she is focused on developing high-impact, behaviorally focused content for the LRN Library. Her most recent project saw her working with the Library team to create a powerful new DEI Program that includes not only LRN’s world-class Inspire courses but also a set of microlearning assets designed to support, reinforce, and guide behavior change.

 

Principled Podcast Transcript

Intro: Welcome to the Principled Podcast, brought to you by LRN. The Principled Podcast brings together the collective wisdom on ethics, business and compliance, transformative stories of leadership, and inspiring workplace culture. Listen in to discover valuable strategies from our community of business leaders and workplace change makers.

Felicity Duncan: Most of us have heard the phrase, "If you see something, say something." But what does that actually look like when someone witnesses bad behavior in their workplace, like bullying or harassment? And how can companies help their employees be active bystanders in the face of misconduct? Hello, and welcome to another episode of LRN's Principled podcast. I'm your host, Felicity Duncan, Senior Instructional Designer here at LRN. And today, I'm joined by my colleague Kristen Motzer, the Learning Director of LRN's Library Course Content. Kristen has over 20 years of experience in technology supported learning and development, and I am a PhD with a decade of experience working in both academic and professional training environments. Kristen, thanks for joining me on today's Principled podcast. So, let's start with the basics. What does it mean to be a bystander and why do organizations have bystander training? Can you explain the sort of core idea here?

Kristen Motzer: Sure. A bystander is someone who witnesses misconduct but isn't directly involved in the situation. So, they see something happening, but they're not actually a part of it. So, being an active bystander is about doing something as opposed to just standing by when you see someone being harassed or bullied or abused. And there's actually a lot of research showing that bystander intervention can have a major impact. When bystanders intervene in situations in the right way, they can stop abuse in its tracks, support victims, and really make perpetrators reevaluate their behavior.

However, very often bystanders witness abuse and harassment and say nothing. That's why we need active bystander training that equips people with the tools they need to intervene successfully when they see something wrong. So, recently we've seen a lot of interest in bystander training from our partners, and Chicago now has an requirement for our long bystander of training for employees in Chicago. But really beyond that, there's a recognition that engaging your workforce to do something, to fight back, to say this is not behavior that we want to have in our workplace can be really powerful. And it's creating a speak up culture.

Felicity Duncan: So, tell me a little bit more about this idea of the speak up culture. What do we mean by that?

Kristen Motzer: So, it's creating an environment where people feel safe to be able to speak up. Of course, speaking up is a little bit scary. You don't know what's going to happen. There could be retaliation, things could change. The folks that usually eat lunch with might not want to eat lunch with you anymore. Things might change an environment that we spend a lot of time in at work. So, creating a safe space where there's an expectation that you see something that you don't want in your workplace culture, you're going to speak up and say something.

Felicity Duncan: So, obviously acts of bystander intervention is really important. We really want this speak up culture that's going to help us build a better workplace environment. So, why don't people get involved when they see problems?

Kristen Motzer: It's a great question, and it's really important to understand that it's not because people don't care. It's not that we're bad people at work or wherever we might be. It's that we're human. And intervening can be really difficult. Psychology has shown research from the 60s and onward that people have good intentions, and people tend to actually believe that if they saw something happening like harassment, discrimination, that they would get involved. But when it actually happens, that intention that they would get involved disappears and they just freeze up. And it's because of our fight, flight, freeze response kicking in. We're facing an unknown situation. We don't know how the people involved will react, and we're just scared of looking stupid, upsetting someone, getting into trouble, being embarrassed besides the possible outcomes like having some kind of retribution losing our job or our workplace friendships. So, from a biological and neuroscience perspective, our brains flood with stress hormones and react as though we're facing something like a bear, a really dangerous situation even though it's a social threat, not an actual bear, it can feel just as intense.

So, when this happens, it's really hard for humans to overcome these instincts and get involved. So, we freeze. We try not to make eye contact, we put our heads down, try to hide, and if we're in a group, behavioral psychology research is found that it's even worse. So, when there's multiple people witnessing a situation, everyone's kind of expecting someone else is going to take action, and we sort of take the lead of kind of like group think. We take the lead from those around us, and if they're not doing anything, then we won't do anything. We have all these reasons why people don't intervene when they're bystanders. And Felicity, given these barriers, how do you train someone to be a bystander at work? I would love for you to take me through how you created the Inspire Active Bystander Training.

Felicity Duncan: Well, luckily for us, the research that you mentioned earlier that talks about why bystanders don't intervene also gives us hope. It shows us how we can overcome those barriers to intervention. At what it really boils down to is being prepared, right? Being ready to get involved in these situations. But the truth is, it's a long road to get learners to that point. So, I'm going to walk you through what we did and why we think that works. So, we begin our training by acknowledging that this is hard. As you said, a lot of people assume that if they're in a bystander situation, that they're going to do the right thing, and then when it actually happens, they're unprepared for how scary it is, and for how strongly and viscerally they react to that fear, right? And so what we try to begin with is getting our learners to understand what to expect, right?

We're really frank about the fact that it's going to be scary. Your palms are going to be sweaty, your heart is going to be pounding. You're going to be really afraid, all right? And telling them that feel the fear, but overcome it because that is not a reason not to intervene. It's just part of the experience. And so, in that way, we try to help prepare them for how it's actually going to be. What they're actually going to feel when a situation arises where they need to make some kind of intervention. Then what we do is we give learners some very practical strategies for how to intervene. And again, we're preparing them, right? We give them a literal list of step one, step two, step three, Here are four possible approaches to intervention. Here's h